آبخوری زیر زبان

امید زمانی

Active member
اسبی هنگامی که دهنه میشه آبخوری رو میندازه زیر زبونش و رو نمیاره و موجب زخم شدن لثه اش میشه ! راه حل این مشکل چیه ؟
 

sohrab

Active member
امید الان تنها کاری که میشه کرد عوض کردن آبخوریه.
اون روز تخم مرغی زدیم؟
 

ناشناس

Active member
خوب نوشتید که زمانی که اسب رو اب خوری میزنیم اسب زبونش رو میاره روی ابخوری و باعث زخم شدن لثه میشه

راه حلش اینه که زمانی که اسب رو ابخوری زدید و مطما شدید ابخوری روی زبون اسب قرار داره همون موقع به کلگی اسب (نوز بند یا فلش ) بزنید تا از باز شدن دهن اسب جلو گیری کنه .اسب هم زمانی که نتونه دهنش رو باز کنه زبونش هم نمیتونه بیاره با لای آبخوری
 

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ناشناس

Active member
یه کار دیگه هم میشه کرد . بعد از بستن نوز بند . اگر میخواهید سوار شوید از شامبون کار استفاده کنید یا بند رنکولان به خاطر اینکه این دو ابزار آبخوری را به طرف پایین میکشد اسب این ازادی را ندارد که زبان خود را بالای ابخوری بیاورد (البته استفاده از این ابزار در هر جلسه بیشتر از 10 الی15دقیقه نباشد ). در زمان لنج هم از شامبون لنج استفاده کنید /چند جلسه این کار را انجام دهید اگر که اسب باز هم زبان خود را بالای ابخوری اورد یک راه حل اساسی بهتون میگم که اسب دیگه هوس نکند زبان خود را بالای ابخوری بیاورد:eek:
 

sohrab

Active member
یه کار دیگه هم میشه کرد . بعد از بستن نوز بند . اگر میخواهید سوار شوید از شامبون کار استفاده کنید یا بند رنکولان به خاطر اینکه این دو ابزار آبخوری را به طرف پایین میکشد اسب این ازادی را ندارد که زبان خود را بالای ابخوری بیاورد (البته استفاده از این ابزار در هر جلسه بیشتر از 10 الی15دقیقه نباشد ). در زمان لنج هم از شامبون لنج استفاده کنید /چند جلسه این کار را انجام دهید اگر که اسب باز هم زبان خود را بالای ابخوری اورد یک راه حل اساسی بهتون میگم که اسب دیگه هوس نکند زبان خود را بالای ابخوری بیاورد:eek:


همون راه حل اساسی رو بگو ناشناس خان. ما ازین امکانات نداریم
 

ناشناس

Active member
همون راه حل اساسی رو بگو ناشناس خان. ما ازین امکانات نداریم


سهراب جان زبون اسب رو با دست بگیر و با نخ (نخ کنفی نازک که زبون رو زخم نکند) نخو دور زبون گره بزن (مهکم نه):eek:وبعد نخ رو به دور فک اسب بپیچ و گره بزن بعد ابخوری رو به دهن اسب بزن .اینطوری اسب نمیتونه زبونشو تکون بده چند جلسه ای این کار رو انجام بده .

قبلا چند تا از اسبهای خودمون هم اینطوری بودن همین کارو با هاشون میکردیم.
 

sohrab

Active member
واقعا این روش جواب داده؟

امید کاشان نخ کنفی گیر میاد این جمعه ترتیبشو بدیم؟;)
 
آره تازه میتونی هویزه,سق دارهم بزنی.
اونجوری مطمئنا"زبونش بالای آهن نمیاد.:p
 

ناشناس

Active member
یک راه حل دیگه هم وجود دارد

زمانی که میخواهید به اسب غذا بدهید کلگی ابخوری به اسب بزنید . بعد غذا جلوی اسب بریزید .اینطوری اسب مجبوره به خاطر خوردن غذا زبونش رو زیر ابخوری نگه داره چون اگر زبون را بیاورد روی ابخوری در غذا خردن دچار مشکل میشود;)
 
ناشناس عزیز
علت روی دهنه آوردن زبان ویابیرون آوردن زبان با فلش,بی فلش,با رینکولان و...چیست؟
 

ناشناس

Active member
ناشناس عزیز
علت روی دهنه آوردن زبان ویابیرون آوردن زبان با فلش,بی فلش,با رینکولان و...چیست؟


این یک نوع تیک میتونه باشه

البته نوع ابخوری هم مهمه . ممکنه ابخوری که روی اسب مورد نظر میندازند سایز ابخوری به فک اسب جور نباشه و باعث فشار اوردن به دهن اسب بشه . یک تکه و دو تکه و سه تکه /شاخ دار .گک پسووا .یا هویزه رو باید امتحان کنید که چه ابخوری به اسب سازگار میباشد /چون در بعضی موارد نوع ابخوری باعث این حرکت اسب میشه

بیرون اوردن زبون که برای بعضی اسبها یک نوع عادت هست /اما اینکه زبونش رو میاره روی ابخوری ممکنه علت خاصی داشته باشه /البته اسبهایی هم که داخل شیراز این کارو میکردن مشکل خاصی نداشتن وفقط به این کار عادت داشتن که با کارهایی که در تایپک های قبلی گفتم / اسب دیگه این کارو نکرد


حالا اگر که این کار اسب علت خاصی داره شما توضیح دهید:rolleyes:
 
ناشناس عزیز
همونطورکه میدانی انتخاب دهنه شاید از انتخاب زین برای یک اسب مشکلتر باشدوما همانطورکه یک زین خود را بر روی تمام اسب هامیکشیم,یک کلگی راهم به سر تمام اسب های خودمی زنیم.این مثل این میمونه که یه دست لباس رو تن همه سایزآدمی بکنیم,مطمئنا"تنشونرومی پوشونه ولی لباس تن یکیشون ممکنه پاره بشه.;)
ضمن اینکه اشاره خوبی به نوع فشاردهنه های مختلف داشتید که به تناسب فک وآرواره هاو...نوع کار وحرکت می تواند متفاوت باشد.
وضمن اینکه امید عزیزاشاره ای به کره بودن این اسب در این تاپیک نداشته,خوشبینانه در گام اول کره فرض کرده وتوصیه به یک آبخوری ساده وتوخالی با لاستیک,به اندازه فک(نه بزرگ ونه کوچک)وتنظیم دهنه روی کلگی (کمی بالاترازمعمول)به طوری که یک چین ونیم درگوشه دهان ایجاد کند.وبعد از آن معرفی وقبول دهنه به اسب باکار وتشویق.
اگر اسب مسن است پس به این کارعادت کرده که در اینجاضمن تنظیم,نوع دهنه را نیز باید تغییرداد.

Introduction to the bit


From: TBear
Hi Jessica,
I wrote to you last spring about a very malnourished thoroughbred colt I was thinking of purchasing, and I very happy to say that I did purchase him and he is turning into a real beauty!! It's amazing what good diet and some TLC can do!
Woody is about 18 months old. He is still a stud, but doesn't seem to know it. He leads well (from both sides), stands for grooming, farrier, vet, etc. He also backs, stops and side-steps on command. I've also spent time sacking him out with blankets, bags, plastic, ropes, etc.
I haven't done any longing or exercise with him other than free turnout, and very occasionally I pony him along when I ride my older gelding, just at the walk. I don't plan to start longing or anything like that until at least next spring. I want to give him a chance to grow up! He lives in a stall with a small paddock attached, big enough for him to trot around and kick up his heels when he wants, and he gets turned out in a big field about 4 times a week, plus my in-hand work with him about 5 days per week. I don't know if it matters or not, but he lives with a very kind and patient 20 year old gelding (they each have their own stalls that turn out onto the shared paddock.)
My question is really about bits. I've read many conflicting things. Some say that a horse should be started with a bit very young so they get used to it. I was thinking of introducing the bit sometime after I start longing in the spring, is that too late? I've even thought about starting his very basic (mounted)training with a side pull and worrying about the bit later.
What is the right time frame and the best way to introduce the bit, and what kind of bit do you recommend? I've been thinking of getting him a nice (not to thick, not to thin) french link snaffle. It seems to be a very kind bit. And what about the material, are german silver bits really much better, or just more expensive? For some reason, this is the part of his training I am most worried about, probably because it is the part I know the least about!
Thanks for any advice you can offer. I just dropped you a note via snail mail requesting a copy of your book, and I'm anxiously awaiting it's arrival!!
Thanks!!
Lisa Pruchansky Austin, TX

Hi Lisa --​

Thanks for the kind words about horse-sense, and I'm delighted to hear that you have provided such a good home for that colt. He's a lucky horse.
My first suggestion, though, is that you make an appointment with your vet and have your colt gelded SOON. At eighteen months, he's certainly ready! And it will make the rest of his life much easier and more pleasant. He'll be able to be turned out with other horses, he won't need special fencing, you'll be able to take him to shows and keep him overnight in other people's stables, etc... all of the things that seem so ordinary, but become problems when you have a stallion instead of a gelding.
Now, back to your actual question... ;-)
I think your idea is a good one, and you can certainly introduce the bit that way. Teach him to longe FIRST, though, and use proper equipment -- beginning with a correctly-designed longeing cavesson. This doesn't have to be expensive, Millers carries a good-quality, well-designed nylon cavesson with hinged steel nose plates for around $30. Your longeline should be long enough -- at least 30', and it should NOT have a chain. Your longewhip should BE a longewhip, not a dressage whip or buggy whip. Using the right equipment makes an enormous difference to the quality of your communication with your horse.
While he is learning to longe, you can have his teeth checked and floated if they need floating. This will make him more comfortable when you introduce the bit.
When he is longeing happily and calmly at walk and trot, and understands basic signals (Walk, Trot, Whoa, Stand), you can add the bit. It's easiest if you use a simple strap -- a bradoon carrier is ideal -- and just put the bit on OVER the longeing cavesson. A simple snaffle is ideal, preferably either a mullen-mouth or a French-link, so that he will be comfortable. You'll want to adjust it a little high at first, so that he won't get his tongue over it (that can become a habit, and it's not one you want!). "High," for your purposes, will mean "high enough that it makes one or one-and-a-half wrinkles at the corners of his mouth."
Don't do anything with the bit -- just put it there, adjust it, and longe him as usual. He won't be as attentive for a day or two, because he'll be focused on this strange new thing in his mouth. But if you keep longeing him, calmly, and ask for a lot of transitions, he will adjust very quickly and accept the bit as just one more thing that you put on him.
After a few weeks, you can add sidereins adjusted quite long, or sliding sidereins. Let him trot for a few minutes with the sidereins attached to the bit -- midway through the longeing session is best. The sidereins should be long enough that he has to push down and forward to FIND the connection, and he won't find it or keep it all at once, but he'll get there eventually. All you want to do is teach him (1) that he can continue to trot forward smoothly even when he feels a little pressure in his mouth, and (2) that HE determines the amount of pressure.
Bit materials: stainless steel is fine. Be sure that whatever bit you buy for him is the correct size, and that it is well-made -- that the arms are even, and that there are no sharp or rough edges or pits anywhere. German silver is pretty -- so is blued steel with copper inlays -- but I suggest that you stay with basic stainless steel. You'll have plenty of time to get fancy later when he's going to shows!
Since young horses need all the help they can get when it comes to turning, and you don't want the bit to pinch his lips or pull through his mouth at any point, think about making his first bit a full-cheek, or at least an eggbutt with large rings. He shouldn't regard the bit as a source of pain or discomfort.
When you start mounted work, a sidepull is a good idea -- or use an English-style jumping hackamore noseband, which is more gentle than most sidepulls. You can use your voice to help him understand what you want (remember, he learned a lot on the longe). You can teach him all of the body language that accompanies rein aids, and when you are confident that you can start, stop, and turn him readily, add the bit just as you did while longeing, and just let him CARRY it, while you work him off the sidepull or hackamore. Then you can add a second pair of reins to the bit, and use both reins until you're able to use the bit-reins more than the hackamore reins. At that point, you'll probably feel quite comfortable and ready to use a conventional bridle. ;-)​


Don't worry about this! You know your colt, and you know when he is comfortable and when he isn't. Teach him gradually, take your time, and enjoy the process. You aren't going to do anything to hurt or frighten him, and you'll be surprised at how quickly he accepts the bit and learns what the signals mean.
Jessica​
 
اسبی هنگامی که دهنه میشه آبخوری رو میندازه زیر زبونش و رو نمیاره و موجب زخم شدن لثه اش میشه ! راه حل این مشکل چیه ؟

اگه مشکل هنوزبرقراره,یه جور لاستیک هایی هست که روی دهنه در داخل دهان اسب قرارمیگیره که از انداختن زبان برروی آبخوری جلوگیری می کنه.:winksmiley02:
 

♘امیرحسین♞

♘ مدیریت انجمن اسب ایران ♞
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times][SIZE=+2]S[/SIZE]lipping the tongue over, or between the bits is a bad habit that horses often develop when they are being started (broke).
It is a serious defense, and it is mostly due to the horse feeling uncomfortable.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] When starting a horse, always adjust the snaffle bit rather high with the noseband correctly placed.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] Slipping the tongue is usually caused by using the wrong bit, wrong size, or incorrect adjustment and usage.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] Note of translator: there is a hollow spot behind the horse's chin (you can usually put your hand in it) between the jawbone, the groove in which the tongue rests inside the horse's mouth. It will be referred to as the "tongue groove".[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] 1. Are your bits compatible with your horse's mouth?[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times]Horses that have a thick tongue or a narrow "tongue groove" suffer from the pressure created by the bit on the tongue and slip their tongue on top of it to relieve the pressure. If the horse has a narrow tongue and a wide "tongue groove", all the bits will be compatible: the tongue will have enough space.
If this is not the case, more room must be made for the tongue.
A "tailored" curb bit ("L'Hotte" bit) helps most of the time. If it's not enough, use a curb bit with a round, square or rectangular groove for the tongue.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] How to tell if the bit is the right size?
The snaffle bit should about 2 mm (1/8th") wider than the horse's mouth at the corner of the mouth, and place slightly above the bridle bit. The curb bit must be exactly the same size as the width of the horse's mouth, therefore narrower as the snaffle bit (about .5 cm - ¼").
Very thick bits are not advised. There is a general advantage to using thinner bits.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times]2. Are your bits well adjusted?[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] The bits have to be correctly placed on the bars (the spaces between the front teeth and the molars) without knocking on the teeth. Adjust the snaffle bit so that the corner of the mouth touches the bit without being wrinkled if possible. The bit must not hit the horse's premolars.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] This is easy to achieve with a horse with a normal mouth, or a rather high-split mouth.
When a horse has a low-split mouth, the snaffle bit is often placed too low and slips under the bridle bit. This modifies the effect of the two bits. The horse then raises the tongue and he can become uncomfortable in his mouth. It's better to have a slightly wrinkled corner of the mouth in this case.
Place the curb bit slightly lower then the snaffle bit, without touching the canines, especially when dealing with a male horse.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] Do not hesitate to add holes in the side pieces of your bridle, even if it does not look so good. It's is very important. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times]The curb chain must always lie flat, and loose when the reins are loose. It has to tighten without slipping up when the bit is at an approximate 25 to 30 degree angle. The bit must never be at an angle greater than to 45 degrees.
A tight curb chain is very uncomfortable, the horse will set his head below the vertical and/or slip his tongue on top of the curb bit or on top of both bits to avoid pressure ; loosen the curb chain.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times]The fine tuning of the bits is done progressively, by trying different ways. It can change. An example is when the leather stretches over time…[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] The noseband should not allow the horse to open his mouth too far, permitting him to slip the tongue. It should just give the horse enough space to swallow and play with the bits… [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times]3. Is it a riding skill problem? [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times]What if the bits are the correct ones, and they are well adjusted, but the horse still slips the tongue?[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] Then it is a riding skill problem… or[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] It can also be a nervous response to the approach of a specific exercise (I.e. the piaffe), especially if it always happens at a certain moment or intermittently. It can also be boredom…[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] Try to determine when your horse is slipping the tongue. Test the horse's calmness and relaxation.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] The most efficient solution is to put your horse in the most comfortable posture possible for him: general balance, relaxation on the bit (head set), height of neck, general relaxation, and degree of impulsion…
Slipping the tongue is sometimes caused by the rider's hands being too harsh or rigid, and do not give when the horse gives, etc.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] The real remedy is to work on putting the horse "in your hands".
When the head is placed correctly, the jaw is mobile and relaxed. The horse chews his bit and gives himself up to the rider completely. He "listens" to the hands of the rider, puts his tongue back in the natural position, under the bit or bits.
This is where the skill of the rider consists of keeping his horse "in his hands".
As soon as the horse gives in, lower your hands profusely.
Try to feel if your hands are the cause of the problem, or if you have to slightly change the posture of the horse, or his head set.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] This is a difficult problem that can take a long time to resolve.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times] In conclusion, check if the bits are well adapted and well adjusted to your horse's mouth, or if you have to revise some parts of your riding skills.
Observe, reflect and feel.
[/FONT]​